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Cylinder 4 misfire       #: 1664
 Moderated by: Mike69, MaDMaXX Page:  First Page Previous Page  1  2   
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 Posted: Fri May 15th, 2020 03:11 pm
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JAMMAN

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Headed out back in less than 10. Kids fed, wife off to work, me time. We will have answers today.



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 Posted: Fri May 15th, 2020 07:52 pm
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JAMMAN

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Well I didn't even get the heads off and made a decision based on what I have seen.
One wonderful thing was the bolts holding the exhaust manifolds to the heads came right out. You could see that the heads looked new after removing a few more things.
Here are a couple of the things I found.



Substantial wear on the rockers where they press the valve stems. About half of them are like this. Since the valve stems have no wear at all I have to assume this happened prior to him (the previous owner) replacing the heads. And he just used them.
Another thing that disturbed me:



This was not the worst one, I tried and was having a hard time getting a good picture Again about half of them were this way. One of them was so bad it looked like someone had cleaned it up on a belt sander.
Substantial wear in parts of the cam too.
My evaluation is that when the previous owner bought it (approx 175,000 miles when he bought it) the poor motor had already been abused  and was way late on proper oil changes. He took it apart, the heads were wasted, by the time he paid for heads and gaskets he just needed to put it together and sell it to cut his losses. I bet he used the worn rockers and the questionable push rods and subsequently the lifters.
Or maybe there is some sort of oil flow problem.
Whatever it is, since I know it burns a noticeable amount of oil, it needs at least cam, lifters, rockers, full gasket kit AND it might need heads I have no idea if they are cracked or not... the motor has to come out.



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00 XLT 2WD RCSB 5.0 swap Gherkin
00 XLT 4WD XCSB 4.0 G2
00 XLT 4WD RCSB Steppie 3.blown. Mistake
00 XLT 4WD RCSB 3.GO! Jalapeño

I don't wear a mask and I have no regrets (Brent Smith)
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 Posted: Fri May 15th, 2020 09:23 pm
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410customs

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134K asking $700 + 200 to ship has MAKE OFFER button
I would say $750 shipped see what they say :)
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Engine-4-0L-Ohv-VIN-X-8th-Digit-Low-Emissions-Fits-98-00-EXPLORER-148766/113824220719?fits=Make%3AFord&hash=item1a8073c62f:g:8SgAAOSw9HNdMfBe

Just something to think about



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 Posted: Fri May 15th, 2020 11:52 pm
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JAMMAN

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I found one in Weirton WV, weighing the trip right now. The pic was in the truck but he has it pulled now. Claims 129K and he wants 500 for it. Says it ran great. Was in a 99. I hope he is storing it inside.

Just chatted with him, it is his dads and I have his number now. I think this might be a unicorn or it might be a turd.




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00 XLT 2WD RCSB 5.0 swap Gherkin
00 XLT 4WD XCSB 4.0 G2
00 XLT 4WD RCSB Steppie 3.blown. Mistake
00 XLT 4WD RCSB 3.GO! Jalapeño

I don't wear a mask and I have no regrets (Brent Smith)
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 Posted: Fri May 15th, 2020 11:54 pm
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JAMMAN

Owns A Torsen


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AND I have 2 of anything he could have busted on it LOL upper lower intake, valve covers...

If I end up with it, it's getting a new timing chain and gears and tensioner. Which I have aready :-)



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00 XLT 2WD RCSB 5.0 swap Gherkin
00 XLT 4WD XCSB 4.0 G2
00 XLT 4WD RCSB Steppie 3.blown. Mistake
00 XLT 4WD RCSB 3.GO! Jalapeño

I don't wear a mask and I have no regrets (Brent Smith)
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 Posted: Sat May 16th, 2020 02:03 pm
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JAMMAN

Owns A Torsen


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Getting closer. It has a good story.
His son was doing an 84 ranger 4wd swap. His friend had a 99 with a 129,000 mile 4.0 and a rotted frame. He bought the engine, harness and ECU was going to put it in the 84.
They decided to go V8 sometime during this. So the 4.0 sits in the back of his garage.
If this story is good then the 4.0 should be OK since they pulled it with every intention of using it. When you pull something with intention of using it you are a little more careful than just hacking and slashing.



____________________
00 XLT 2WD RCSB 5.0 swap Gherkin
00 XLT 4WD XCSB 4.0 G2
00 XLT 4WD RCSB Steppie 3.blown. Mistake
00 XLT 4WD RCSB 3.GO! Jalapeño

I don't wear a mask and I have no regrets (Brent Smith)
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 Posted: Sat May 16th, 2020 02:10 pm
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410customs

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and that is a wicked good price for a 99 ohv with 130k!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I would be on my way



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 Posted: Mon May 25th, 2020 01:31 pm
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JAMMAN

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OK it is home. I plan on putting the replacement on the stand and freshening it up including timing chain, water pump, valve cover gaskets.

Was wanting to ask and I should know this because I tore one down but can you replace the rear main without taking the oil pan off like on a 5.0?
I have so many 4.0 parts laying around, I think I even have a pre painted timing chain cover/housing, I have 2 other sets of valve covers, upper and lower intakes, too much to list. Part of me wants to drop the engine in there and get it on the road, part of me wants to make sure it will out last the transmission LOL.



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00 XLT 2WD RCSB 5.0 swap Gherkin
00 XLT 4WD XCSB 4.0 G2
00 XLT 4WD RCSB Steppie 3.blown. Mistake
00 XLT 4WD RCSB 3.GO! Jalapeño

I don't wear a mask and I have no regrets (Brent Smith)
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 Posted: Mon May 25th, 2020 03:20 pm
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410customs

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Woooooooooooooohoooooooooooooooo good job!!

yes you can do rear main w/o removing oil pan
I would remove oil pan though, have a look see at the pickup screen, replace the oil pan gasket. 
The big oil leak spots on the ohv are:
valve covers
oil filter mount O rings
Dipstick
Oil Pan



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 Posted: Mon May 25th, 2020 03:52 pm
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JAMMAN

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OK oil pan gasket shouldn't be that much more expensive. I just don't know how much work I should put in it being the entire truck is 200000 plus. Would hate to put another week and 3-400 into the 4.0 just to have something else give out soon. I'd be yanking it and selling the shell LOL.

Plus I don't have a good way to clean parts any more and no sand blaster. Can't paint over crap. I simply won't paint over crap LOL.



____________________
00 XLT 2WD RCSB 5.0 swap Gherkin
00 XLT 4WD XCSB 4.0 G2
00 XLT 4WD RCSB Steppie 3.blown. Mistake
00 XLT 4WD RCSB 3.GO! Jalapeño

I don't wear a mask and I have no regrets (Brent Smith)
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 Posted: Mon Jun 22nd, 2020 10:49 pm
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JAMMAN

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Curiosity got the best of me. Since the old engine was on a stand I took the heads off. Can you tell which was cylinder 4?




Take a look at the felpro gasket. Almost looks like it happened before it was installed, like a dent or something. The trail you see is between a water passage and cyl. 4 supporting my original diagnosis but how it happened is a mystery.







So subtle yet so destructive. 

Good news is the heads have less than 40,000 miles and show absolutely no cracks at all. They got an oil bath for storage.




For those of you that have had to buy new heads, I priced them at around 400. So I can buy a ranger with a 4.0 and bad heads lol. 

There was a noticable gap between pistons and cylinder wall, cylinder wall looked like glass.



____________________
00 XLT 2WD RCSB 5.0 swap Gherkin
00 XLT 4WD XCSB 4.0 G2
00 XLT 4WD RCSB Steppie 3.blown. Mistake
00 XLT 4WD RCSB 3.GO! Jalapeño

I don't wear a mask and I have no regrets (Brent Smith)
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 Posted: Tue Jun 23rd, 2020 08:24 am
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Chris

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JAMMAN wrote:
Curiosity got the best of me. Since the old engine was on a stand I took the heads off. Can you tell which was cylinder 4?

There was a noticable gap between pistons and cylinder wall, cylinder wall looked like glass.

Lol - the one at the end??

There should be a noticeable gap between piston and wall when cold, otherwise it would seize when hot!



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 Posted: Tue Jun 23rd, 2020 12:08 pm
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JAMMAN

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Blows oil. Plenty of it.



____________________
00 XLT 2WD RCSB 5.0 swap Gherkin
00 XLT 4WD XCSB 4.0 G2
00 XLT 4WD RCSB Steppie 3.blown. Mistake
00 XLT 4WD RCSB 3.GO! Jalapeño

I don't wear a mask and I have no regrets (Brent Smith)
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 Posted: Tue Jun 23rd, 2020 12:59 pm
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410customs

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interesting! Looks like maybe bad gasket or like you said something before/during install gouged the gasket....



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 Posted: Tue Jun 23rd, 2020 01:10 pm
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Did you check the torque required to brake the head bolts loose? 

My guess is the bolts were reused or not torqued properly as well.



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 Posted: Tue Jun 23rd, 2020 01:57 pm
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JAMMAN

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No I did not check the actual torque. I did think it was a little easy to break them loose. I used a breaker bar, untorqued them in sequence and in steps to keep the heads as straight as I could.

I have examined the gasket with a magnifier and it looks like it was damaged, the ridge doesn't look like it was eroded from flow. This might have been like this longer than I knew of. I replaced the radiator and the cap after I had a tank side split. Was probably from pressure from the cylinder. I figured there was something up when that happened. Plus for a year prior every once in a while after getting off the highway at the first idle situation it would sometimes start missing.

Might have been installer error but just in case I'm not getting FelPro gaskets. I'll go with the next best.



____________________
00 XLT 2WD RCSB 5.0 swap Gherkin
00 XLT 4WD XCSB 4.0 G2
00 XLT 4WD RCSB Steppie 3.blown. Mistake
00 XLT 4WD RCSB 3.GO! Jalapeño

I don't wear a mask and I have no regrets (Brent Smith)
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 Posted: Wed Jun 24th, 2020 07:52 am
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Chris

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I only use Payen (Felpro) composite gaskets, never had an issue, even on 11 to 1 CR race engines.

The rust on the fire ring suggests to me that either the head was not torqued down correctly or the block surface is not flat. I always have the block and heads skimmed flat when rebuilding or replacing head gaskets and always with a grinder, not a flycutter.

Put a straightedge across here and see if there is light under it in this area -




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 Posted: Wed Jun 24th, 2020 02:08 pm
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Good info there @Chris !!
This is not the gaskets fault
Fel pro makes the best gaskets for your engine PERIOD
ALWAYS INSPECT YOUR GASKETS when installing , gaskets often sit around the shop waiting to be installed, I can tell you I have about 12 sets of 4.0 and 5.0 head gaskets sitting around for years...because it is cheaper to buy the entire engine kit then individuals, so the result is extra's. Before I would use any of them I would inspect the snot out of them....it is too easy for something to get bent, gouges, a piece of debris, etc...... Like a surgeon!
This is installer error IMO, even somebody who does engine gaskets alot can easily screw up a head gasket job and for those of us who do them often.....for the amount of time and money involved in replacing head gaskets...well lets just say you cannot take and short cuts or it will bite you in the ass!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
New bolts every time, torqued by the book every time, PERIOD

4.0 head gaskets are tricky, I have seen WORSE installs that is for sure, what happened to this engine could easily happen to any of us!! You think you have everything perfect and BAM one piece of debris or one nick on a gasket = FUBAR



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